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Svetlana's avatar

My problem with the consent argument is it sounds like circular logic based on impossibility. I mean, we all know that it's impossible to consent to your own birth, that's just causal physics, an IS statement, but to say therefore it's wrong to create people (under any circumstances) is like saying we are wrong to procreate because we can't defy physics. It's basically setting up morality to always fail, due to impossibility of applying it (moral consent). Is it still morality if we give it no chance to succeed? This feels anti reality more than anti natal.

In morality, we don't apply this impossible condition to anyone that already exists, we often say something is wrong because they "should" have acted differently, based on a set of moral prescription (oughts), this means at the very least they have a chance to act differently, the right way (let's not go into determinism for now, lol). But for procreation we have no such chance, due to physics.

You could argue that not procreating is that chance, but the issue here is consent, not procreation per say. If consent is not violated, then procreation should be permissible, but physics give us no chance of not violating it. It's basically blaming people who procreate for accepting the reality of physics. I'm sure any rational parent would love to ask their future offspring for consent, if at all possible, they wouldn't be so cruel as to deliberately create someone that they know will hate coming into existence.

Come to think of it, it's the same for risk of harm, it's just impossible for someone to never be harmed after coming into existence. This is why in morality we often differentiate between acceptable risk (impossible to fully prevent) and unacceptable risk (reckless endangerment), the latter often immoral to impose on someone, but not the former. If we say no categories and amount of risk are even acceptable, then once again we are setting up the impossible for morality, as if we want it to fail to justify our argument.

Some would argue that there is no "need" to create someone, therefore we have no moral obligation to do it, in fact it would be immoral to do it because we know that we can't defy physics and the reality of risk in procreation. But I would argue that we do have this need, because the desire and intuitions of existing people matters, namely the need to continue the species, to prevent extinction, to perpetuate mostly positive conscious experience, as long as conditions allow and life is not a hopeless nightmare for most.

Some would argue that its selfish for existing people to fulfill their desires and intuitions, at the expense of every new generation we create, due to the risk of harm. But again, this is the same impossible rule that we are judging people with, there is no physic defying ways for people to not be selfish when creating new people, it's the consent argument rehashed.

Conclusion, is morality even applicable to situations where it's impossible for morality to even function?

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